Episode Notes

Research Interests

• Care policy, work, politics
• Aging, disability, and mad studies
• Immigrant and precarious work
• Critical consciousness/ social movement learning
• Community-engaged research and learning
• Critical theory and qualitative methods

Selected Publications

Nicholson, L., Hande, M.J. & Migrante Manitoba. (2023). Justice for Im/Migrant Home Care Workers in Manitoba. Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives – Manitoba. https://policyalternatives.ca/publications/reports/justice-immigrant-home-care-workers-manitoba

Hande, M.J., Keefe, J. & Taylor, D. (2021). Long term residential care policy guidance for staff to support resident quality of life. The Gerontologist: Special Issue on Workforce Issues in Long Term Care, 61(4): 540-551. http://doi.org/10.1093/geront/gnaa176

Hande, M.J., Jamal, A. & Kelly, C. (2020). Direct Funding and the depoliticization of home care systems: Popular rhetoric and policy directions in Ontario. Canadian Review of Social Policy, 80: 26-49. https://crsp.journals.yorku.ca/index.php/crsp/article/view/40353

Mirchandani, K. & Hande, M.J. (2020). The hidden work of challenging precarity. Canadian Journal of Sociology/ /Cahiers Canadiens de Sociologie, 45(3): 265-288. https://journals.library.ualberta.ca/cjs/index.php/CJS/article/view/29676

Learn about MJ’s influences

• Chris Smalls (labour organizer)
• Karl Marx
• Ethel Tungohan (York University Professor)

Learn about MJ’s interests

• Long Term Care
• Student Mental Health in Ontario
• Mental Health Resources at Trent
• Mental Health and COVID-19
• Mental Health, COVID-19, and Youth
• Health Care Activism
• Classical Sociological Theory (open-access textbook)
• The Great Canadian Baking Show
• Academic Anties (podcast)

Transcript

Beth: Welcome to the Social Profs Podcast with your hosts Beth Torrens and Kristy Buccieri. This is the podcast where we attempt to turn teaching inside out by engaging in conversations outside the classroom with faculty, community members, and Trent student alumni. Our goals with these conversations are to learn more about the benefits of a criminology or sociology degree and to talk about the ways that students can get more involved at Trent and in the community. We will also do a deep dive with some Trent professors to learn more about their approaches to teaching, what drives their research, and a few fun facts you can only learn when you turn teaching inside out.

Kristy: In this episode of the Social Profs, we sit down with Assistant Professor MJ Hande to talk about her interesting in studying and reimagining our health care system. We learn about health care activism, her renewed love of classical sociological theory and why you will catch her playing board games on the weekend. MJ, thank you so much for joining us today. We really appreciate it. We’re wondering if we could start off just with a general question. What is the one burning question that drives your research and what got you interested in trying to answer it?

MJ: Um, I think perhaps the one burning question that I keep coming back to is what health and well-being would look like outside of our current kind of political economic system and what, you know, what do we need to do to imagine our health and well-being in a broader and more socially just way. And I guess what got me interested in that, I guess it’s, you know, as most you know, research starts from a personal place I grew up with a parent who had multiple sclerosis and spent most of her life in a long-term care home. And so I just spent a lot of my childhood, you know, visiting her in that long-term care home and trying to process and make sense of her life there and people’s attitudes towards her and our family because of her, you know, health issues. And it just really motivated me to think about, you know, how we can imagine these things differently outside of these kind of dominant healthcare approaches or just social attitudes towards people who do have health challenges. And so that’s just really just been, you know, pushing me towards new questions and new projects for the rest of my life.

Beth: That sounds like some really great work that has the potential for a significant impact on a variety of people, but also work that can be emotional or difficult for people to maybe talk about with their struggles with health and social reactions to health. How do you handle teaching or sharing your research findings about more difficult topics?

MJ: Um, yeah, when I saw this question, I was thinking about difficult, maybe in a couple of different ways, just difficult in terms of people, it being emotional, and like, perhaps really personal, and like maybe even triggering and then there’s also difficult in terms of people just being defensive because the idea is threatening to them somehow. So I guess maybe I’ll try to briefly answer both of those types of difficult, which I do get both of those in my classrooms all the time. Um, the, I guess the, maybe I’ll start with the second, um, I think, you know, what I’m realizing the, the more I teach is that I need to really provide a lot of space, um, and different types of kind of learning methods or approaches, um, to help people understand difficult material in multiple ways. So, they have ways of approaching it from multiple perspectives and hopefully connecting to it in a personal way or finding inroads into connecting into a personal way. So, I like to do that by, you know, bringing in people who do have personal experience, so people see it as something with the topic. So, people do see it as something that isn’t just, you know, an academic exercise. They understand it’s personal and real and has very important, you know, implications for people. Um, I also try to challenge people to discuss varying perspectives on an issue, you know, just in group activities. It doesn’t sound super, you know, sexy or exciting, but I do feel like those kind of group discussions, or even just paired discussions, really help students process and understand that other people in the classroom may have a very different perspective on these issues. And then, you know, also just, you know, reflections and various readings, right. But then, for the personal things, I think there’s also maybe a similar approach where, oftentimes, students do become emotional in the classroom when we talk about health, because, you know, students are also struggling with their own health challenges, right. And it’s surprising, especially when talking about mental health, in the classroom, a lot of students share really personal experiences in the classroom. And so it’s really important to kind of create space for people to have their lived experience acknowledged and respected in the classroom, um to address, you know, tensions in the classrooms so students don’t feel like it’s not a safe place for them to share those experiences. And I think also, there’s also like a lot of students who are close to people who have health issues or are working in kind of health-related professions like social work, a lot of students working in nursing homes or retirement homes I find in my classes. And so I think just putting students in a position where they can build their learning from their personal experience and connect with people who are kind of entering that topic from a different perspective I think really help students process things and understand that there’s so many diverse ways of approaching the same topic. I just really try to foster that in the classroom. I had an email from a student after wrapping up the semester and she’s an older student with a lot of life experience and related to supporting people with health issues. And she shared that she had never considered a lot of the perspectives that we discussed in the class. And that made me feel like I had maybe accomplished a little bit of my goal of helping people, like I said, going back to that driving question, understand that there is such a diverse and we shouldn’t limit our imagination about what health and wellness can be and a lot of that means that we have to be really creative and we have to be really open to thinking about how diverse our perspectives are on these issues.

Beth: What a fantastic opportunity for students to have some of those difficult conversations or to challenge their own perspectives and the perspectives of others but to do so in a safe environment and I’m glad that you know students have recognized kind of the benefits of that. What do you think a favorite topic for students is in some of your classes? A favorite topic?

MJ: A favorite topic? Well, I think it’s always different depending on the student, right? But when I read this question, I thought it was my favorite topic to talk about. I guess I can also talk about the students. That one too.

Beth: I figured we’d just start with students and then we can work our way back and see if your favorite comes up.

MJ: I do find that students, I do find that the mental health, because I teach sociology of health and illness, and then I teach another course called Key, it’s just called Key Concepts and Sociological Analysis, but I also talk about mental health a lot in that class. And I felt like that’s one of the topics that I think resonates the most with students. It is also very challenging because I think students who don’t have lived experience sometimes, you know, the way that they express their opinions about those things can be, you know, challenging for students who are living those things. But I do find that there’s usually a lot of enthusiasm because it’s something that, especially during the pandemic, everybody has, you know, kind of contemplated a bit, you know, the effects of like lockdowns on student mental health, you know, the, the, you know, policy debates around how we can better support people with mental health moving beyond those kind of like resilience frameworks or thinking about resilience, mental health resilience and in broader ways. I find that that’s something that most students can relate to on some level and have a lot of thoughts on. So I would say that’s maybe the, the, it’s a, it’s a difficult and challenging topic, but I do feel like students seem to connect to that and enjoy kind of, you know, thinking through it, it’s like it’s not just like a thought experiment for them, you know, or it’s more than a thought experiment for them. Yeah, and I guess, you know, maybe related to that is one of the things that I find one of my favorite topics is really trying to provide students with different what examples of kind of health activism, because that’s something that I’ve always been really passionate about is, and that’s part again of that driving question of like, I find a lot of health activists have really, you know, blown my mind in terms of how they imagine the limits of what health and wellness can be and what a better future might be for people who have health challenges. And I know students sometimes get really stuck, you know, they often do reflections and they’re like, how can I change this? Why is this happening? You know, why is nobody doing anything about this? So it’s always really exciting for me to kind of share all the creative and wonderful stuff that is happening right now in terms of healthcare activism.

Kirsty: It’s all really interesting. And I think lends itself to an opportunity to think about if you could bring these people together and you could bring together celebrities and theorists and activists and politicians dead or alive and have a dinner party. Who would you invite?

MJ: Yeah, this is this question. I was like, oh man, I don’t know. First of all, I have a lot of anxiety about bringing really, really diverse people together and having to moderate a conversation. But then I was like, there are people that I would really love to meet that will probably never get a chance to meet. So, the people that I was thinking about aren’t necessarily health related, you know, thinkers or scholars or activists, but are maybe people who are thinking about maybe thinking outside the box and have really, I think really interesting and exciting ways of thinking about different possibilities, different worlds. And so the first, I guess, I’ve been listening to a lot of M.I.A., the British rapper lately, and I just think her music is really innovative in terms of like bringing kind of like a really like transnational vibe to like all of her music and talking about issues of refugees and borders, which I think is a really pressing issue right now in the contemporary moment and I just think her music is cool. So I was like, oh, I’d love to have MIA at a dinner party. And then I just also just maybe during the pandemic hearing a lot about a lot of labour organizing that was happening and I was really compelled by the Amazon worker labour organizing. and I thought Chris Smalls is like a really unconventional labor organizer, but, you know, unionized Amazon and that was really cool. And he just seems like a really interesting guy. So I was like, I’ll just bring Chris Smalls into the dinner party. And then, yeah, I guess, you know, I taught classical theory, classical sociological theory last semester and I really, that was great for me to kind of get to get revisit a lot of those kind of foundational, you know, the canonical, you know, thinkers in sociology. And I was just like, oh, like I’ve had a new appreciation for Marx after reading or reading through some of his original texts for that class. And I just thought, well, maybe I’ll bring Marx. It’d be interesting to know what Marx thinks about Chris Smalls and MIA in the contemporary world. So those are the people that I thought of when you sent this question to me. Yeah, mostly just because I think it’d be interesting to bring somebody who is maybe trying to think about the things that MIA and Chris Smalls think about today, but just was in a totally different historical moment. Yeah, and just get a sense of how they what they would think of each other.

Kristy: That would be a fascinating dinner party to attend for sure. One of the things we’re doing with this podcast is we’re kind of collecting some of the music interests that our faculty have mentioned and putting together a playlist. And so I think it will be really interesting for students to hear M.I.A. next to Erick’s Emmylou Harris and just the very diverse Oh, interesting. The diverse musical tastes of our department. We’re also going to work on a faculty cookbook. So we’re asking also, what would you serve at the dinner party?

MJ: What would I serve? Well, I wasn’t expecting that question. Well, I really love seafood. That seafood is something that I crave all the time, except when I was pregnant, so I would probably serve some sort of like seafood stew or something like that and wine and have something yummy and chocolatey for dessert. I don’t know. It’s kind of on the spot, but that’s what immediately comes to mind.

Beth: That sounds delicious and a very enlightening conversation that you would probably have with that group.

[Music]

Beth: Our next series of questions are a mix of maybe some serious, some fun, just get to know you questions. They’re going to come at you rapid fire.

MJ: Okay.

Beth: You don’t have to elaborate on your answers, you can give a short answer, a one word, two word answer. And we’re just trying to flip the script and give you a bit of a pop quiz so students can get to know you a little bit more. Are you ready for the rapid-fire questions?

MJ: All right, fire away

[Music]

Beth:  What is your favorite memory from when you were a student?

MJ: I would say the first thing that popped into my head was a professor an English professor that I had that was just he was actually a Catholic priest and I’m not Catholic, I doesn’t raise Catholic, but he was very irreverent and I went to a friend’s dance recital. It was an adult tap dance recital and all of a sudden my 70 year old Catholic priest English professor went on stage with purple bell bottoms and tap dance shoes and I was totally blown away. It was really awesome.

Beth: Nice, professors do have a life outside of teaching.

MJ: He was into tap dancing and he was awesome.

Beth: What is your favourite thing to do on the weekend?

MJ: My favourite thing to do on the weekend? I would say right now, if I ever get a chance, it would be playing board games. I just did that this past weekend for the first time in quite a few months and it was really awesome.

Beth: Nice. As an academic what is something you can’t live without?

MJ: My laptop

Beth: Is their favorite TV show podcast or movie that you have?

MJ:  I would say my favorite TV show is the great Canadian baking show

Beth: What advice would you give your past student self?

MJ: I would just say you belong in academia. I think I’ve struggled to feel that for a long time as an undergraduate.

Kristy: If you could instantly have any skill, party trick, or talent, what would it be?

MJ: To fly.

Kristy: What course or subject did you not take as a student that you wish you could learn more about now?

MJ: Maybe classical sociological theory.

Kristy: You can learn more at your dinner party with Marx.

MJ: Yeah

Kristy: Who do you admire?

MJ: I guess the first person that comes into my head is one of my colleagues at York University, Ethel Tungohan, who has a really awesome podcast that I really admire a lot about advice for getting through academia called Academic Anties.

Kristy: Cat, dog, fish, bird, or lizard?

MJ: Dog, definitely.

Kristy: And if you weren’t working as an academic, what would you be doing?

MJ: Oh, I would love to be involved with dancing or music and playing music or dancing in some way if that was at all possible.

Beth: Thank you for taking the time with us, MJ. It was great to learn a lot more about you and about the way that you approach teaching and learning in your classes. Thanks for joining us.

MJ: Thanks for having me.

[Music]